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Apr 04, 2017 at 05:31 AM
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I would say wrong as it is posted with selection of English language

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i wonder how many rubbish tags (pardon, wrong tags) live within a Community

does someone delete such tags?

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In my opinion about 2200 official tags and countless more user tags.

"SAP BusinessOne a piece of cake" is the English translation for above Russian tag.

When I have to edit a blog or a question anyway because of an alert then I will take care about tags too. Other moderators have already reviewed the official tags and made a proposal. The hope is still there that this tagging experience will change a bit in future. But what will you really do if even experienced SAP employees define such user tags as above?

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"a piece of cake" - polite translation :)

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"It's clear even to a hedgehog." Closest English idiom is probably "it's not a rocket science", or "it's no-brainer". Either way not as nice as cake, unfortunately.

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Something like this. :)

It's a bit more than 'piece of cake' in English. It rather has ironic-diminishing connotation, while 'piece of cake' has an encouraging one.

P.S. Tags should be controlled, moderated and their volume drastically REDUCED; this is also "и Ежу Понятно" :)

0dnmu.png (215.1 kB)
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"Ежииииик !!!!"

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Denis, there are probably just 2 more people on SCN who could understand your cultural reference :)

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True, but I just couldn't help myself.

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"The hedgehog knows what's up". :) It is kind of funny but rather inappropriate for a professional forum.

Looks like a user tag with just one "blog" posted by an SAP employee. The blog content is not at all representative of the tag name, so this is rather "false advertising" IMHO. The author might have thought this was somehow amusing or funny but it's just not. Moderators, helloooo...

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Hi, everyone:

It's difficult to manage user-generated tags, but I did remove this one and let the author know why. Perhaps he'll feel like a rock star knowing that something he posted triggered an entire Coffee Corner conversation. I'm almost jealous.

Not to get too off track, but as Jürgen noted, there is ongoing work to improve the tagging experience -- which includes a reduction of tags. I don't want to say more just yet. I learned my lesson after promising email notifications in January...

Best regards,

--Jerry

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Jerry, if triggering Coffee Corner conversations makes one a rock star, then I suspect you qualify! Certainly you are a major participant in a great many long-running CC conversations, in any case. ;)

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Thanks, Matt! That made my day. :)

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Jerry is a man of great courage!

And thick skin?

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Thanks, Mike. To be honest, Jerry is mostly a guy trying to do his job -- which sometimes includes wearing a target and waitng for the bull's-eye. :)

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Yes, not many SCN team members venture out to the Ranting Corner. Pretty much a suicide mission. :)

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Hi colleagues,

First, thank you - you make my day (or maybe week :) ).

I was a little bit surprised to see such nice discussion, but anyway... Few comments from my side:

1.Based on section Managed Tags and User Tags from link below this is not clear why I'm not able to use any of decent text? https://www.sap.com/community/about/using-tags.html

Where is mentioned some restriction that I need to follow?

2.Moderation

From my point of view - if something is not clear - delete it. You choose tag, started to discuss and block the whole post. Why? Spend few more sec and see that the content is fine. Simply delete tag and go on.

Once again - my personal expectation, that if you are trying to moderate, doing this as smart as possible.

3.Meaning

This is phraseology. The meaning of the phrase is tooo easy. "Уже понятно" - "it's as plain as it can be".

It so easy, that everyone can understood.

This is famous Russian author Vladimit Mayakovsky. https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Author:Vladimir_Mayakovsky

This phrase from - The tale of Petya, fat child from 1925.

If it is not possible to use this tag, I'm ok. Let's delete it and will try to post the Blog. Thank you

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Personally, I didn't find the tag offensive, I liked the reference :)
The problem, which I see with the tag, is that the description is too long and it contains both Cyrillic and Latin characters. If you really need to add user tags, it would be better to use shorter descriptions, or even split into two separate tags.

There is also the language issue - currently, there is no option to post content in Russian and filter by Russian language, which means, that your blog is seen by people, the majority of whom would not understand what the tag description meant.
At least I am not aware of an easy and obvious way to search and filter blogs by title and user tags (you could modify manually the search URL, by adding +Tags:<tag name> or bookmark the user tag url <blogs url>/tag/<tag_name>,

but I won't expect that many would do that.

And you still need some way to introduce this user tag to the readers, which is the main point of adding it. I did not have the chance to read your blog (it is not accessible anymore to regular members), but one option could be - use some SAP-managed tag for SAP Business One, then mention in the blog, that this is going to be a part of a series, which would share a common user tag <tag name>.

If the blog content was OK (I cannot verify as a regular user), a complete deletion seems to be an overly harsh measure. I suppose, that the best approach in this case would be to contact the moderator and discuss whether it is possible to recover it in draft mode and republish the blog after adjusting whatever he pointed out to be a problem.

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+1. Tried to post a longer reply but SCN won't let me. Clearly a conspiracy!

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The SAP icon is short for "Illuminati"....don't tell anyone.

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Hi, everyone:

I'm involved in this (as a moderator), so I thought I should chime in. I hope it can address some of the newer comments here.

First, I didn't block anything because of a tag. I did remove the tag initially, because of the discussion here (and I cited this conversation in my editorial comments…along with a link). There really isn't a way to police user tags easily. Since this user tag triggered a whole conversation in Coffee Corner, I thought it prudent to react.

To be clear: The user tag itself had nothing to do with the current status of the blog -- which is still eligible for publication.

Moderators have the ability to set a blog post to "needs more work," then, through editorial comments, explain what the author should revise. This doesn't delete the blog, but does make it unavailable for public viewing. It also allows the moderator and author to work behind the scenes...which is what I did. (Yeah, I'm the bad guy in this case, but I would never outright delete anyone's blog. I always do what I can to help the author along.)

The bigger issue here isn't the tag at all. It's language. As Veselina noted, Russian is not available. English is the default language for all posts -- because, for better or worse, it's the language most accessible to the vast majority of members. People have the option to select other languages, but those are limited. The languages, in turn, have a limited number of tags. (The languages themselves are not tags.)

There are details about localization-- and the rationale for the choices -- at https://blogs.sap.com/2016/08/10/non-english-languages-in-the-new-community/. I know this topic has been the source of heated debate and conversation elsewhere in the community and Idea Place, but that doesn't change how the system currently works. Which brings me to the key point: Choosing English as the language (because it's the default), then writing in another language, simply isn't permissible. (Jürgen observed as much in the very first comment.) If we allowed that, we would end up with a mess. (OK, a bigger mess. I'm sure that's what some of you were thinking so I'll save you the trouble of saying it. :) )

I assume that the vast majority of members would prefer to write in their native languages (I know that I'm lucky in that the official language is also mine), but making the community a global resource means choosing a common language wherever possible. We can't stop people from selecting one language, then writing in another, and in some cases, these blogs might slip through the cracks. But inevitably someone will raise a moderation alert.

In short, the "blocking" that occurred here was because of the language and for no other reason. The recommendation was to publish in English instead. Even if the post itself is valid only for a Russian audience, we can't have non-English content showing up randomly with English-based primary tags (e.g., SAP Business One).

I hope that helps shed a bit more light on what occurred.

Best regards,

--Jerry

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Thank you for explaining, Jerry.

Are there plans to get blog filtering by both language and tags in blogs.sap.com soon?

Looking at SAP Business One tag (and knowing that language restrictions apply only to the primary tag selection), this could be a really nice improvement. I suppose, that separate rss feeds are not feasible, but at least a multiple select filter in the blogs page for a tag should not be that hard to implement.

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Hi, Veselina:

I know that efforts to fine-tune filtering are ongoing, but I'm not sure about languages specifically. Let me see what I can find out.

Best regards,

--Jerry

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Hi, Veselina:

Re-reading your question, I want to make sure we're on the same page.

While there are six language options when creating a blog or writing a question, not all of the tags are available for every language. As soon as you choose a non-English language, you can only pick from a subset of tags. (If you select German, for example, you can choose SAP Business One and Training as tags. There are no additional options.) That greatly limits the number of language and tag combinations for the filter and we wouldn't want to give people the option in almost all situations.

Maybe you're already aware of that. But again just wanted to make sure we were on the same page.

Best regards,

--Jerry

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I meant the following: let's assume we have a blog in Portuguese with primary tag NFe and secondary tags SD, ABAP and MM. This is allowed, because the check is performed only for the primary tag.

For people who use RSS, fixed links or subscribe to these secondary tags, the blog would appear along with English, Spanish, Chinese content.

Please, don't get get me wrong, I support diversity, and I am glad that non-English speakers have a way to contribute here, but when reading about SD/MM/ABAP, I prefer to use an additional optional filter and see content only in languages, which I can understand.

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Hey Jerry,

"we can't have non-English content showing up randomly with English-based primary tags "

Is this a change in policy?

Up to know it was my impression* that readers would have to accept this, and just skip blogs the languages they don't understand!

To challenge the rule you stated:

Have a look at Tag "Training" (not sure what exactly makes a "English-based primary tag", but I would guess it is one, as it doesn't say "Trainig - German" ?) https://blogs.sap.com/tags/676305042803066886656318788802663/

-> Quite a lot on non-English content there - (should I alert it? ;-) )

*I remember a case where a Spanish(?) blog was posted on the S/4HANA-tag, I asked "is this ok?" and Juergen L commented: "Try it out: you can't select "Spanish" language on that tag -> so it's OK, as it's not possible to do it "right").

best

Joachim

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I did not mean that adding secondary tags (intended for English) should be prevented by implementing an additional check for language- as long as the assigned secondary tags are correct, this is absolutely fine. I believe, that there are forum members, who can answer SD-related questions in Spanish/Portuguese/German in addition to English, but have chosen not to follow all possible language-specific tags.

This has no impact on moderation activities. I still cannot understand what is the technical difficulty to implement a second filter for language in blogs.sap.com, answers.sap.com or in the tag pages. In the third option (tag pages) the property is already there, the only problem is that it appears to be hard-coded as English. No matter how I tried, I could not force the tag page for Training to accept German, which is a funny thing.

Compared to adding checks to prevent secondary tag assignment, which is not going to solve the case, where the same tag is allowed for multiple languages, adding a filter by copying the one from the tag pages and removing hard-coding from the search are probably similar in terms of additional cost and effort. I don't expect that this could have a major performance impact, either. :)

*** I wanted to reply to your original comment, Jerry, unfortunately the nested comments bug is still present, sorry! ***

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Konstantin, I suppose a quote from Big Trouble movie pretty much sums this up: "This isn't about rules, it's about manners. Now there's no rule that says that I can't come over here and f*rt on your entree. But I don't do it. Why? Because it's not good manners." (video)

1. Russian is no longer one of the languages officially available on SCN (see this blog). There are no designated moderators for Russian language and there are, in fact, just a few people here who even understand Russian (most of them commented here). How many of them would also care about Business One? Close to 0 probably. So I'm rather confused why you chose to post such blog in Russian to begin with. Was it really something relevant only to Russian SAP customers? Why, oh why...

2. As I mentioned above, the verbiage is simply not suitable for a professional website, especially the one run by your employer. One could've pulled off a "tongue in cheek" tag if the blog content matched it. But, no disrespect, the blog itself was rather pedestrian (I read it before it was deleted), so it just looked odd and not amusing.

3. I see that you've posted another blog recently using the same tag. Just to let you know - such "announcement" blogs with 2 paragraphs and a picture are not well received on SCN in general. There is a bit more expected from the blogs on SCN, see here and here, there are many more posts on this.

This is why I referred to the original one as "blog" and that's why it could've been deleted in its entirety. Blogs need to add value to the community. Use Twitter or other media for the short announcements "hey, we have this field in a new version".

4. +1 to what Veselina said.

Well, I hope you understand and the moderators won't have to break any fingers. :) I'm all for the freedom of speech on SCN but this is not the case, sorry. It's just bad manners. Think how you could improve your content going forward, so that the whole community could benefit more.

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Hey Jelena,

about

> Such "announcement" blogs with 2 paragraphs and a picture are not well received on SCN in general.

Do we maybe have to make a distinction between old SCN and new SAP Community (which is broader, I think, e.g. more marketing-people blogging) here?

Just today I came across such a blog (1 Sentence, 1 Link): https://blogs.sap.com/2017/04/24/overview-on-product-lists-in-sap-hybris-cloud-for-customer/

Can you quote a current source that this is not ok? Do you think I should "alert" such things when I see them?

Someone once explained to me, that such blogs are link-targets for e.g. Twitter-posts, which I thought is a valid use-case.

Also, I personally would like to have a 1-line, 1-link blog "BC6.5 is available now! [download-link]"(once that's the case) on tag "UI SAP Business Client (NWBC)", as that would be the fastest way for me to get that info via RSS.

best

Joachim

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Hi, Joachim:

If I may chime in (assuming you're not sick of me yet :) )...

The current source that I would cite is this page: https://www.sap.com/community/about/blogs.html. It describes what a blog post is/should be -- with specific instructions for SAP employees.

Personally, I would recommend moving something like that example to the wiki (which is a more appropriate home for that type of content). And while I understand why you would find such a 1-line/1-link post beneficial, it isn't a blog in the strictest sense. Again, another reason why this type of product content got migrated to the wiki.

Sooo...if you did want to raise alerts when you see those things, I think that's perfectly valid. For now, I brought this particular post to our blog lead (Jamie).

Thanks -- and I hope that helps!

Best regards,

--Jerry

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Joachim, other than ROE there are no strict rules about the blog content. If there was a written rule then the content would be gone and we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

There is a long story behind the "announcement blogs". In my opinion, both old and new SCN are dearly missing a separate Announcement feature, which would solve this problem. The concerns about such blogs were so far as follows:

- this is an equivalent of "link bait" on SCN;
- when we had points, it was unfair that authors of one-liners were awarded the same points as the authors that posted thoughtful and/or informative content;
- blogs remain on SCN a long time but for how long one would actually care if a new version became available (if a blog has no other information than announcing the fact)?

I believe the major factor was just not meeting the expectation and therefore not adding enough value. E.g. one sees a title and expects to find a real blog there but finds just one sentence and a link. It's disappointing. That's why I didn't state it was "forbidden" but that such blogs are not well received.

You have a valid point about RSS but keep in mind that there are much better ways to make an announcement while also posting a decent blog. We have many authors here (Horst Keller, for example) who do just that. They don't just post a sentence and a link, they add their opinion and valuable information. E.g. what features you'd find in a new version, what you need to keep in mind, etc.

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I think, for SAP GUI, this announcement feature is done in a better way - they a have wiki page, to which you subscribe and you receive notifications when a new version is released.

You still get notified for new things, but the best part is that everything is kept in one place and you don't need to go through multiple pages to get a version history overview.

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Good point. I've also seen some people maintain a single blog that is getting updated periodically. Then anyone interested can follow that blog for updates.

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