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[Status Update] I would really like to know who is liking my content

So... I finally wrote a blog this year (https://blogs.sap.com/2017/01/02/returning-to-work-after-loss/) /endSelfPromotion

It would be nice to see who I'm reaching - old SCN allowed us to see who liked out blogs and the comments.

SAP Idea was set to not planned for requesting visibility but for SAP Q&A. Not sure if same for blogs https://ideas.sap.com/D38342

However, I find this quite frustrating as up votes and downvotes are another one to see who is participating in the thread. They may not write a reply but seeing a well-respected member vote for your reply adds value to the threads.

Oh well.... I've got blogs stuck in my head and will write with hopes that there is an audience that they are reaching :)

Regards

Colleen

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Jan 17, 2017 at 11:09 AM
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Hi Colleen,

I used to be enamored with my point count before and for the first two years of my time at SAP. As an independent contractor, the point count was something used to demonstrate technical prowess (or as I used to refer to it, Street Cred). Once I was hired as SAP, I was made a Moderator for the Manufacturing Integration & Intelligence (MII) community and had hard metrics to meet for my performance reviews.

But over time, the point count as such became less important and I was much more interested in providing Correct Answers and receiving Likes and postive comments from members who had my respect including your esteemed self. Points beyond a certain point did not increase your status in the communities and SCN overall. Up/Down votes have replaced Likes in my mind and convey the same feeling of accomplishment when someone like yourself, Juergen, Simone, Matt, Tammy, Jelena, and many more I could list, have indicated approval of something I wrote. That people I that regard highly and whose approval carries a hefty weight, makes it worthwhile to contribute. The actual counts Up or Down make no difference without that weighting factor from considering the source.

I also have some blogs in mind and will eventually find some time to write them, but since I am mostly operationally and process focused, most of them will be in the Moderator Jam Group with only a few tagged with Using SAP.com or Coffee Corner (unless they kill the CC blog functionality).

Cheers, Mike (Moderator)
SAP Technology RIG

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But over time, the point count as such became less important and I was much more interested in providing Correct Answers and receiving Likes and postive comments from members who had my respect including your esteemed self. Points beyond a certain point did not increase your status in the communities and SCN overall. Up/Down votes have replaced Likes in my mind and convey the same feeling of accomplishment when someone like yourself, Juergen, Simone, Matt, Tammy, Jelena, and many more I could list, have indicated approval of something I wrote. That people I that regard highly and whose approval carries a hefty weight, makes it worthwhile to contribute. The actual counts Up or Down make no difference without that weighting factor from considering the source.

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This is pretty much why I loved to see who liked my content on old SCN and why I still stand by my opinion, that this should come back here on the new platform.

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Thanks for naming an humble button-pusher like me Michael: i'll do my best to disappoint you and lower your expectations!

But i agree with it: it's the same discussion we had about 6-7 months ago on the old, beloved, SCN with Jelena too.

After a certain point, who cares about levels? We begin to cares about who seems to agree and follow our posts.

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Hey Simone,

You'd have to work really hard to lower my expectations of your contributions. You could rest on your laurels, but it is not in your nature!

We have all been around for a while and our view of points is not shared by those who are later in coming down the path we trod years ago. Let's have some empathy for those who don't already have that large cushion of points that we accumulated early on. Many still desire the visible evidence of their contributions via points and/or badges. We were once there ourselves. Even if I, personally, think gamification is a very low priority especially given all the major outstanding issues, it's still necessary to encourage those who are not yet satisfied with their individual status.

Cheers, Mike (Moderator)
SAP Technology RIG

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You'd have to work really hard to lower my expectations of your contributions.

Are they already so low?! *chuckles*

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No, my expectations are quite high and won't drop anytime soon. I don't think you are capable of lousy contributions. Cheers, Mike

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Lol! Way to willfully misinterpret, Simone! ;)

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Just so you know, I liked your comment just now, Mike! :)

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Oh, and Colleen's discussion as a whole. So there's no mystery about that one particular like point. ;)

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I'm very much missing this too. It was a part of the whole SCN social aspect that got destroyed by the new website.

This also allowed to see that the blogs in the space we don't speak of were mostly liked by the SAP employees. Hm, maybe that's why we don't have this anymore...

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Back in SCN days I asked about the "goat", now I have to ask about the "space we don't speak of" -> what's it about? *curious*

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*pssst*... It's called "Business Trends"... *scurrying away*

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They should really allow to post only images in blog's comments

1hv9us.jpg (31.2 kB)
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It's so we can secretly "like" your memes about Business Trends...

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OK, thanks Steffi and Simone!

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It is possible to see who liked a discussion - they hid this via CSS, but you can display the element with a few clicks.
It is also possible to see who up-voted a question or an answer, but not who liked a comment or a blog (at least I haven't found a way to get this information)- I have always thought of this as one of the many peculiarities of the new site.
For blogs I prefer to have 'rate' instead of 'like' - I am more likely to open a page from my RSS reader to rate content (at least this helps to filter out weak content and promote exceptional blogs), than to press a single button, which has lost its meaning for me due to Facebook usage.

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Trust Veselina, our friendly neighborhood SCN hacker, to find a way around the UI! :)

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Full disclosure alert: I was like #11 and I am also now Following this. To avoid flooding everyone's Activity feeds, I resisted the urge to 'like' any individual comments below, so I hope no one is upset by this :)

We are all curious human beings, so having this hidden by default is also quite perplexing to me, and have to wonder, where the requirement for that came from...

Being an avid SAP Jam user, I actually leverage the transparency for views and likes, but not in a big brother is watching mode, but more so I know who is actively interested in a particular piece of content, or joins a calendar event, etc. I see blogs and discussion threads much in the same way --> small working groups of community members engaged for a period of time in asynchronous discussion, debate, or fun conversation. Combine this with the greatly missed @mention feature (available in Jam), and threads come to life in a whole new way (any thoughts of past Jive features are purely coincidental).

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You mean anyone is actually paying attention to the Activity feed?

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Paying attention? Well, since you commented on my comment I received a notification. What led you to my post - the Activity Feed?

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Actually, it did! But since it's not reasonable to look at more than just the most recent few minutes of activity in that feed, that's pure chance. I DO pay attention to my Notifications feed, though, so that alerted me to your comment on my comment. :)

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Well, I found it 'cause I check Coffe Corner from time to time...

And the "[time] ago in Coffee Corner" under a disussion tells me if there's something new

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Hi All,

At the risk of getting pummeled for this, I will share that you are actually able to see who liked your blog in the activity stream. Of course, I do understand that right now you're probably only going to see that if you're sitting on top of your activity stream watching non-stop for the days after you post your blog, because everyone else's engagement activity on the things that you follow shows up in the same stream and you have to wade through all of that to see the likes on your blog. Not an ideal situation, to say the least.

The decision not to display who liked or voted on the content itself was based on a combination of factors, one of which was benchmarking against other professional community sites (i.e. not FB), where it turns out that such transparency is not generally provided either. Particularly in the case of voting, there was pushback from various corners on transparency of downvoting. Even now the downvoting activity is not sent to the activity stream. StackOverflow does not provide such voting transparency either.

From a reputation program perspective, I actually do believe that providing transparency of who liked and voted has more benefits than drawbacks. But reputation is not the only consideration, and I just get one vote. :-)

--Audrey

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Hello Audrey,
are you able to see in the Activity stream when a person, who you are not following, likes your blog post?
I am not criticizing the proposed solution right now, I really don't know what is the expected behavior of the Activity stream anymore.

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Hope this helps - Sajid has recently documented some of the as-is behavior in the following blogs:

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Same question. Maybe I just missed it in the activity stream but I have a suspicion that not all likes actually show up there. Hard to test since I'm following pretty much everyone here. :)

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Jelena, filtering by the Social Activities filter may help cut down other activities in this case.

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Sajid - the problem I see with your proposal is that although the Social Activities filter does showcase all the likes, follows, upvotes, etc. I would prefer that it would give me the option to exclude them. Comments, answers, and blog creation (new typing involved) are what I would like to 'filter on', especially with the precious vertical real estate consumed by the 10 items. Blogs or Q&A filters have the same social activity noise, so really don't do much other than segregate content.

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Jeremy, the 'Blogs' filter and 'Questions and Answers' filter do not show the noise you are referring to (up votes, likes, follows). I believe the blogs filter only shows new blogs, blog comments, and blog updates (new typing involved). On the other hand the Questions and Answers filter only shows new questions, answers, Q&A comments, and Q&A updates (new typing involved). Could you please clarify which type of activity you WOULD NOT want to see after applying these filters?

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I can see the likes on my blogs from people I am not following, I scrolled and scrolled and scrolled for minutes to answer this question. :-)

Phew, there are really a lot likes here

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Cool, I didn't know/forgot how this worked - I am still thrilled that somehow my Activity stream magically started working again.

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So as it turns out, there is a caveat: you do see likes and upvotes from people you are not following and who are not following you, but only if you follow the tag in which you posted. Sigh...

Let me clarify that: If you follow the tag in which you posted or if you follow the actual content on which you posted, you will see likes and upvotes, regardless of whether or not you are following the people who are engaging on what you posted. Otherwise you will not.

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Thank you, this explains why I have always seen a subset of the likes - I don't follow any tags and because of the inertia of the simpler way to do things in Jive I don't click 'follow' on my own content, incorrectly assuming that I would see likes as well on top of blog comments by default. This is similar to auto-following questions functionality, maybe just a little bit trickier (I have read that AnswerHub provide auto-follow setup out of the box, but I don't know if the blog platform has anything comparable to that).

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Still there is a significative difference between a blog and question/answer.

Really big one indeed.

Plus, without having a way to group/sort/filter notification, the Activity Stream is absolutely useless, nothing more than a background babbling .


And, btw, on Linkedin, i can see who liked a piece i wrote or shared .

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HI Audrey

Thanks for joining the discussion on this.

I argue that knowing who votes and likes posts is more than just reputation.

I did raise this post about wanting to know about my own posts but there is more to it. Some has been mentioned throughout the post. Here’s my argument for the case why there should be visibility:

  1. Social community engagement and interaction. Human nature – the obvious is the connection of the post (what my start to this status update was about). It’s nice to know that when you put yourself out there in the community to see who is appreciating your content or following it. And I can understand how this has meant that gamification/reputation comes into play.
  2. Adds authority to people’s feedback. Seeing people who you respect as a thought leader or expert in their area add a like or up vote a post adds more credence to it – especially when the comment is in disagreement to the original post. The number of times I’ve come into a thread where a user is asking for advice and receive numerous answer to achieve something. But the value of such a thread is when you see an expert join the thread and argue why the solution is bad advice and try to encourage the poster to consider a different solution or challenge the original premise of the requirement. There a plenty of other scenarios to this even down to finding a thread via Google that's a few months old and trusting the provided solution based on who participated (especially through votes of support)
  3. Encourages and highlights up and coming members. In extending the first point, to see someone that I respect like an unknown member draws my attention to them and what they have to say. After a while I might find myself expanding my network and following other members. It creates such an opportunity for me learn something new in a topic that is not my expertise.
  4. Draws attention to a discussion or topic that I would not typically visit. This is through seeing likes and votes appear in my activity feed from those who I follow. I’ve found myself jumping into tags (well was spaces) on topics that I’ve known nothing about and learning in the process. It keeps content fresh
  5. Identifies points chasers and other poor community behaviour. As a moderator, one of the common things I would do as part of investigating a person violating RoE would be to look at the patter or likes on content. A few of us were able to identify collusion amongst members who would go in and vote for posts of their friends.

I’m hoping the above is sufficient to justify some other benefits of seeing who likes content and posts. In relation to activity stream – it will never be the ideal solution for providing this type of feedback nor would it support most of the points that I have made:

  • I had to press “More” at the bottom of my activity feed 6 times to see the first up vote of this discussion.
  • I don’t want to have to sift through my activity feed on a post I wrote 6 months ago to find out who I interacted with.
  • It won’t cover my points 2 to 5

In relation to benchmarking against other platforms, I can see why Facebook was not included as it’s not really a professional site (although funnily enough, I’m interacting with a lot more community members via FB since being pushed into JAM and some of the platform shortcomings). However, LinkedIn does allow you to see posts. Reddit, would not be a good example due to their voting algorithm and volume of votes (as well as scripts/etc that members use to accumulate karma). I’m not as familiar with other platforms to be able to comment.

But, does it really matter what those other sites do if our own community members see value in this? SAP Community is meant to be a professional platform where we encourage people to remove themselves from the shadow and be themselves. Seeing this information is an aspect to that.

I would be interested to know what is the concern with transparency when it has been a primary value for our community as we embrace this new platform? It’s strange that this is something where transparency is not valued (perhaps prioritised) relative to how open and forthcoming the SAP Community team is with their communications.

And so, I’ll stop the war and peace now. Thanks for supporting this level of transparency. I hope those who outvoted you see this reply and reconsider the position

Regards

Colleen

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/sign

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/sign or sigh...

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Activity stream?!! Oh hell no! Hulk smash! :)

+1 to Colleen. How does the rationale "other sites are not doing it so we ain't gonna" align with the image SAP is trying to project as a company? The industry leader that just does what others are doing? Right...

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@Jelena - I see your comment as sooo 22 minutes ago...

As discussed in many other places the whole social media aspect becomes the expected norm in so many areas of our work/private life blur, so when we as community members also expect this when coming from the past Jive platform, I also wonder how this change or simplification effort made it through the q-gate.

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Hear, hear!

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Hello Colleen,

Given the current scenario where even though such actions are shown in the user's activity stream, it isn't sufficient in isolating this activity (like_blogpost), would you suggest that such feedback should be shown as a Notification? Because currently we do have this gap (where positive feedback events such as like_blogpost, upvote_question, upvote_answer, like_comment) are not shown to the user exclusively. User's would have to be following their own individual piece of content or the primary tag where the content was posted to be able to see such events (and who performed them -actor) in their Activity Streams. Such social events can then be filtered by the "Social Activities" filter on the Activity Stream. And of course, if the user is not exclusively following the primary tag or the specific piece of content (in this case their own content) then these activities would not show up in the Activity Stream at all.

To tackle this, I proposed the idea of showing these actions as Notifications instead to an 'Activity Stream and Notification focus group'. Interestingly the advisory group did not think that such notifications are necessary and will only serve to overwhelm the Notifications service. I am of course willing to re-open this discussion in light of the points you have presented here. However please be advised that my efforts and suggestions are only in the scope of Notifications and Activity Stream services. The ability to see who liked a blog on the blog itself would have to be developed from the blogging platform with advice and support from the blogging SME. I will share this with Jamie (leading dev efforts in Wordpress) so she is in the loop as well.

Thanks for taking the time to express your thoughts and providing valuable feedback.

Best,

Sajid Amir

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Hi Sadjid

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As a member of one of the advisory groups as well as a Moderator, I agree Notifications is not the solution. I've had to mute Twitter to stop all the emails every time someone retweets and likes something that I say - it's just a way to get spammed if too much is sent out

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Activity stream is the right place for advising the author of their comments/posts. We all agree here, however, that the current design of activity stream is unworkable

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The enhancement many of us want to see is the ability to see the likes and votes from the blog or question - just like old SCN used to allow. Again, with benchmarking let's compare it to SAP Jam and Ideas Place: both of these platforms allow us to see who likes and votes for content.

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"However please be advised that my efforts and suggestions are only in the scope of Notifications and Activity Stream services. The ability to see who liked a blog on the blog itself would have to be developed from the blogging platform with advice and support from the blogging SME. I will share this with Jamie (leading dev efforts in Wordpress) so she is in the loop as well."

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Understand the roles and responsibility and that it does appear to be a more in Jamie's remit. However, this is for both Blogs as well as Q&A.

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Regards

Colleen

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P.s Full stops between each paragraph as a test to see if it improves paragraph spacing :)

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Bump up. Now I really want to know who is voting on the answers.

Not so that I could take revenge on the down-voters but I'd prefer to know if it was someone with any SCN street cred (in which case I can use this as a learning experience) or just OP not happy with the answer or some drive-bys. If not the names I'd prefer at least to see some voter credentials. It's OK if someone doesn't like my answer but would prefer to see whether I can learn from such feedback or just ignore it.

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Totally agree - and also really like Colleen's thoughtful writeup of the why's and "where-fores".

Sorry to say, based on Moshe Naveh's comments - https://answers.sap.com/comments/129586/view.html - it looks like this issue is going to be "fixed" so that even the current loophole won't work.

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